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no mounted style or large gps's for worlds
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Will R



Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Posts: 681
Location: NWT/Alberta

PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well put Willie! now after watching this for a bit im sorta leaning towards the ban of them being the correct one. they talk about showing rocks and obsticles and short cuts and time advantages on route marked clearly on the gps thus adding to safety well heres another idea if you come into an area that your not sure of 'SLOW THE FK DOWN"instead of relying on the gps to safely navigate you through the rough stuff.what happens if your race line was good one day and the water level for some reason drops a foot or so now putting dangerous obstacles in your plotted race line? so now you come flying down the river all nice and relaxed with your navigater watchin the screen making sure you stay on your race line not realising that strange ripple in the water that your going to be on in a split second that wasnt there the day you pre run(safety device has now become a safety hazard has it not?) but its on your race line and you keep the hammer down...BAMMM you nail it!what happens if the racing is really close and your squezzed off your race line by another boat now making the driver nervous?sounds like the begining of a recipe for disaster. sorry if i upset anyone with this but forums are open for discussion from both sides and another thing to ponder sure most racers are seasoned pros and probably wont use gps as soul source navigation but what about the guy thats new to boats and boat racing and because you alow the big screen gps and does use it as his main source of navigating instead of dialing in his/her skills in reading water and recognizing hazards wreaks and gets hurt do you want that to happen?gotta think of everyones saftey in this sport not just your own
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Alumaman



Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 302
Location: Whitecourt

PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

deleted

Last edited by Alumaman on Fri Oct 29, 2010 9:54 am; edited 1 time in total
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gatr



Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 20
Location: gravel bar

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 1:19 am    Post subject: GPS Reply with quote

If your going to race at speed through a marathon or just a weekend race you must be able to read the river. I wouldnt place my life in the hands of any electrical device at 100 plus miles per hr. Its like asking your toaster to find your way to work in the am.
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TOP DAWG



Joined: 15 Jun 2005
Posts: 581
Location: Peace River Alberta anada

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thats a pretty unfair statement gatr, Ive been using GPS for some time now racing and prerunning, explain to me how a GPS will lead you astray if you pre-run a number of times and plot a safe course on your map. Then when your racing you decide to remain or not on the pre-determined safe passage. Ultimately the driver is in control, my navigator had a nice 9" screen to look at where we had plotted a course and addded points of interest for his attention. When we raced, I trusted hed keep us on the safe pre-determined course, it's very relative to how you use the instrument. In GP this year Jesse foster had a faster time on the first leg then I did, my boat was faster by a few miles per hr that I know. He obviously chose a different race line then I did and kudos to him for that, i ran what i though was a safe race line according to my pre-ran plotted race line. In Peace River on the Smoky run when we were pre-running, Chad, Colby and myself all found a significant underlying ROCK that we knew would be difficult to spot on the down river run, I plotted it on our GPS, now if my F*%#ing engine has stayed running LOL we would have avoided this rock, Colby on the other hand hit it and wrecked his boat. He didnt have a nice GPS to plot it on the day before, Chad managed to avoid it and so did a bunch of other guys that didn't use GPS, all im saying is Colby might have avoided it had hed been using the kind of GPS I have. Wouldnt it be nice for all teams to have the choice to use the devioce they want ? Isnt a small handheld GPS going to be harder to read then a nice color 9" screen , and take more attention from the navigator ???
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boosted



Joined: 04 Jun 2009
Posts: 378

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

x2
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Mark

Lets go back I think we missed one rock!
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whitehead



Joined: 21 May 2009
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So if gps is used to mark out rocks why did Jesse and mark hit one spinning out on the beach on the way down the smokey in 08 they did say the used it for three years and in 07 Grant and Elaine hit a rock tearing a whole in the sponson on the way from Wapiti gardens to Bezanson I know they use a gps I think it might be like Will R is saying trying to take aggresive race lines while depending on a mass produced electronic device and by the way Dawg Colby had a gps and marked that rock he hit Shocked
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TOP DAWG



Joined: 15 Jun 2005
Posts: 581
Location: Peace River Alberta anada

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know he uses one, but not one like the one I was using, with the big screens, icons and notes, your GPS warns you of upcoming troubles that have previously been marked. Its up to the Nvigator to warn the driver and the driver to make necessary adjustments to his speed or course. I still cant see how the cons outweight the pros on SAFETY, but keep trying
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:44 am    Post subject: Brain McGregor's response Reply with quote

I heard from the 2010 Western Zone Meeting that NZ is dropping C & D Classes & in future want to split Turbine & Piston Unlimited, drop A, B, C & D Classes move small block to 450 cu in. This has not been presented to the UIM to my knowledge, only discussion with Dale Whiteside & Robbie. These class changes affect many Canadian racers and now is the time to address this situation and not after the UIM has changed the classes.

On the other hand the GPS rule was presented at our Western Zone meeting in Nov.7,2009 . Once again, many of the complainers were not in attendance to pick up their awards & cheques or voice an opinion. Only 14 of the possible 50 race teams were in attendance. These racers went through the proposed 2009 rule changes that were to be presented at the 2010 UIM Rules Meeting in Mexico this spring which Dale & Robbie attended( I could not afford to attend this meeting). It was at this Mexican meeting that these rules were discussed & adopted to be presented to the UIM. The GPS rule is under the Equipment section of the UIM rule book which I think canít be changed in the advanced program. I have contacted the UIM in regards to the GPS issue.

This year, 2010, only 11 teams attended the Western Zone Meeting in Peace River on Oct. 02/10.

You can now see the importance of attending these meetings and making decisive decisions regarding the rules. According to Tom Stanley, it takes 2 to 3 years to reverse or amend any UIM rule.

I will gladly give up my position on the UIM Rules committee to one of you dedicated racers. I hope the World Race committee has more dedication than this!

The UIM by 2012 is proposing to only give medals out in ONE class only which I think should be Overall, & the Race organizer supply the class trophies. Each Country can still have their own classes.

When we sanction a UIM event we should run by the UIM rule book as we adopted this back in 1999, which makes the playing field the same for all participants from any country.

Brian McGregor
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Alumaman



Joined: 26 Jul 2005
Posts: 302
Location: Whitecourt

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
and in 07 Grant and Elaine hit a rock tearing a whole in the sponson on the way from Wapiti gardens to Bezanson I know they use a gps


reminiscing....the rock we hit in 07 was a big chunk of concrete that had washed down river and was sitting high and dry on a gravel bar.
Coming down stream my navigator said "right channel - right channel" but it just didn't look right so I went left. Should have listed, as the left channel was a trap and we were soon running in 4" of water with no place to go. Tried to turn a 180 but there was not going to be enough room, so I straightened out and pointed at the 2 foot high gravel bar with hopes of making it over and back into deeper water. We skidded over the rocks no problem but the left sponson caught that chunk of concrete, ripping the hole in it.
I got into that situation by ignoring my navigator and the GPS.

First race in '06 we tried notes on paper, that was not good.

[/quote]
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Itsworthit



Joined: 15 Jun 2005
Posts: 432
Location: Whitecourt

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It possibly looks like the GPS rule maynot be changeable in the advance program, so all of us naysayers who were NOT at any of the Rules meeting should sit on the sidelines and shut up, unless there are plans on appealing this UIM ruling, so maybe a new thread should be started, "support for the changing the GPS rule"
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MISSBHAVEN



Joined: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 319
Location: Grande Prairie, Alberta

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

whitehead wrote:
So if gps is used to mark out rocks why did Jesse and mark hit one spinning out on the beach on the way down the smokey in 08 they did say the used it for three years and in 07 Grant and Elaine hit a rock tearing a whole in the sponson on the way from Wapiti gardens to Bezanson I know they use a gps I think it might be like Will R is saying trying to take aggresive race lines while depending on a mass produced electronic device and by the way Dawg Colby had a gps and marked that rock he hit Shocked


We didn't know that the rock we hit on the Smoky in 08 was even there, so we didn't have it marked on our GPS. As said many times on this post, GPS 's are important to use to only supplement your navigation. GPS's are not a cure all and as Willy B said, we can't use them as an autopilot, but I think if used properly they will save more accidents then they'll cause which I think should be the ultimate reason to having them.

We'll have to see how the new GPS rule is worded in the UIM book and if you don't like it, then it's time to put up or shut up. If you believe strongly about it, either for or against, then get organised and attend the meetings. Brian is right, if you want to have input, you have to attend the meetings.

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Last edited by MISSBHAVEN on Tue Oct 26, 2010 1:04 pm; edited 1 time in total
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YKX



Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 181
Location: Yellowknife

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:58 am    Post subject: gps Reply with quote

To keep everyone on the same level, host country should PRE Program the SAFE route for ALL racers so everyone would have the same SAFE route with alternate routes for passing, etc..... That way everyone is on the same side, no advantages of choppers/pre run, etc....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HellecNGqbQ&feature=related

after all, it is Technology, just how far to you want to take it????

m2c

YKX
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TOP DAWG



Joined: 15 Jun 2005
Posts: 581
Location: Peace River Alberta anada

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's just a non productive comment
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Last edited by TOP DAWG on Tue Oct 26, 2010 12:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Will R



Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Posts: 681
Location: NWT/Alberta

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 12:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lol but dang cool vid!
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Vegas



Joined: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 12:29 pm    Post subject: no large gps Reply with quote

wether it be a 4 inch monitor or a 9 inch monitor the result is the same. most inexperienced navigators keep their eyes peeled on that thing anyway. with that said wtf is the diffrence? an experienced navigator is typically reading river and guages .as we all know there used only for brief reference... i just wish i had a photographic memory. i cant wait until next year ....LETS GET RACIN.
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